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We saw "Reset"! Of course, BBCA had run past the hour, but some kind soul had put the last minute or ninety seconds on YouTube (click this link if you need the last bit too) so that we could see that yes, Owen was really dead.
AAAAHHHHHH! Don't do this to me, Torchwood! I want escape! Not death! Owen is my least favorite character. I don't care. Give him back.
Okay, okay. I couldn't stand it. So I took the easiest cheat there is. I'm not even going to link, so you have to want to do this yourself if you want to know (unless you already get spoilers, or you're ahead of the US on episodes), but I couldn't stand it. I went straight to IMDb to see if that was Burn Gorman's last episode. I'm not giving the answer here. You can look it up if you want. You can also laugh at me for being pathetic. (I will note that Brilliant Husband, however, didn't budge from my shoulder after the YouTube clip ended while I looked up Burn Gorman.)
I haven't posted after every episode, so you get a hodgepodge of my thoughts on the last few. Mostly: I'm still loving it.
"To The Last Man": Oh, Tosh! Oh, Tommy! (Oh, SGA! Who stole whose title?)
"Meat": everyone said it was gross. It wasn't so much gross; it was terribly sad. I didn't quite cry, but I was close. Oh, Jack! You wanted to save it! You did all you could! Oh, Owen! You probably did the best that could be done at the time. I love that Gwen brought Rhys to the Hub. Her refusal to give him retcon helps make up for her terrible awful nearly unforgivable affair with Owen. I liked the little bit where Ianto says they never had a fiancé before, and Tosh says they're all pathetical singles, and Ianto and Jack just give each other a little look.
"Adam": wow. Riveting from first to last (until frelling BBCA cut out a few seconds early!). We couldn't help but notice they put Adam into the opening montage! Yay for detail work! I'd watched the previews (yeah, they give away too much, but I'm a preview addict currently trying to find a recovery program. Wait, I've got one--it's called Brilliant Husband saying, "You told me not to let you watch" and turning the tv off right before the preview for SGA's "Last Man"), so I knew he was up to no good. I think I'd have known he was up to no good anyway, though! Did this remind anyone else of SG-1's "Fifth Man"? Except that there the alien wasn't hurting anyone (not much, anyway). Adam was malicious, and very scary.
I found sweet, neat Owen really awful. (But major points to Burn Gorman for doing a totally different character! Great job!) I felt really bad for him. Adam hadn't just made him "happier," as he claimed. He made him pathetic, a target for derision. I'm not sure how much was for his own amusement, and how much was for distraction: while Owen was pining for Tosh, he wasn't noticing anything odd, and Tosh had her attention split between Adam and poor fawning Owen.
But Gwen--that was even scarier. I didn't know whether she would remember Rhys, and that was horrifying. We had a moment of happiness when she found she could essentially fall in love with him again.
But of course that couldn't last. Of course Ianto keeps a diary. Of course he keeps it at the Hub, because to take it elsewhere would violate security protocols (hey, he had a few lapses about Lisa, but otherwise, security protocols are serious, right?) And of course he notes down interesting artifacts--especially if Jack finds them. I knew when Adam found him with the diary, it would be bad, but I didn't know it would be that bad!
(Interlude: I was interested to note when I went to YouTube looking at bits to see if any contained the final scene with Jack and the box--yes, I know how that sounds--anyway, I was fast-forwarding and discovered the YouTube "Best of Jack and Ianto" clip for this episode contained a number of seconds that we hadn't seen. I couldn't see any rationale, except cutting down the time for commercial. They didn't cut the worst bits, or anything: from what I saw, and my faulty memory of the episode, they cut the moment where Adam says he helped Ianto hide the bodies, and then there's a moment showing the two of them carrying a body between them. Also, I think the BBCA version had Ianto only talk of one murder; in the clip, Jack asks him to describe the second and Ianto starts before Jack shuts off the lie detector.)
I love the way Jack dealt with Ianto here: initially scared, a little angry ("Quit joking around!") but then absolutely immovable: Ianto didn't do these things. Nothing Ianto says will convince him, and the best lie detector ever made won't convince him, so he keeps looking until he finds the answer. He doesn't consider that whatever is wrong with Ianto could really have made him murder women, because that's just not Ianto.
I also love Jack's inflexibility on what Adam has done to Tosh. Tosh still thinks it's love, and I want to send all the Stargate writers and producers who had anything to do with "Hathor" and "Irresistible" to watch the scene where Jack tells Tosh that she did not consent, no matter what she thinks right now. He's right, and continuing a drugged delusion (for that's essentially what it is, whatever the alien's mechanism) isn't free will. He persuades her--doesn't force her--to take the retcon. He doesn't say "rape," but he doesn't have to.
Jack's losing points for having read Ianto's diary at the end. I know he doesn't really remember what happened, so he has no particular concern with violating his team's memories right now--but you just don't do that. Yes, even if you think it's about you, Jack, you don't do it. (Husband says that, having done it, he's right to tip off Ianto that he has; I concur, but still!)
And "Reset"!
Martha totally rules! I was so thrilled to see her! Loved her with all the team! Trading quips with Jack--the only one who can fully keep up! She had Owen totally outgunned. Martha and Gwen: "Are we the only two people on the planet...?" "What're we doing wrong?" Laughing at Jack!
Could not believe that Jack not only asked for a UNIT cap, he told Martha who he wanted it for! But he and Ianto seem to be discreet, although I never thought I'd use "Jack Harkness" and "discreet" in the same sentence! And then Martha had the nerve to ask Ianto about Jack! Ianto got the deer in the headlights look for a moment, and then recovers! "Innovative. Bordering on avant-garde." We howled (and had to run the TiVo back to catch the lines we'd missed). I guess the boys are both happy, and they want to be able to tell someone. I'm glad they're happy. I want it to last.
Hepatitis! Brilliant! You know what's more brilliant? Taping the assassin to the steering wheel of the SUV! Tosh, I love you! Ianto: "You are warped deep inside. How do you even think of these things?"
But Owen! Nooo! Now Martha will feel guilty, because they were rescuing her, whereas if she'd just left the compound as she was supposed to, no one would have been shot! Don't know if we'll see Martha again. Didn't look her up. Can't hear you (la la la).
Questions for discussion!
1. Rhys saw Adam briefly; does that keep him alive in some small way?
1a. Do Rhys and Gwen ever compare notes about those 48 hours?
2. Owen denies sending the flowers at the end of "Adam," but he gives Tosh that funny little smile that we only saw on Geek!Owen previously. Then, in "Reset," he finally agrees to go out with Tosh! Does this mean there are bits of not-quite conscious memory left? Is Adam still affecting them? (Does this mean Tosh feels love for someone she can't remember? Worse, that Ianto feels guilty for horrible crimes he can't quite remember? I was afraid that Gwen might have residual doubts about Rhys, but I hope that's wrong! Do not want!)
3. Has Owen's death saved Tosh from a train wreck? Because if they'd gone on that date (did he really not realize she was asking him on a date? How dense!), more would have followed, and--well, Jack used a line I frequently use while watching shows including Torchwood: "It will end in tears."
4. I said if Tosh and Owen would be a train wreck, Jack and Ianto could be a multi-train pile-up. "No," said BH. "Just street pizza." (Had to ask for a translation. I'm more familiar with "road kill" or "flattened fauna.") Of course, we concluded that after the whole CyberLisa debacle, street pizza might be bit of a relief.
I feel ridiculously torn. I'm not much of a shipper on most shows. Keep your romance off my Stargate shows (those writers can't do it anyway), and Star Trek, for the most part. But Aeryn and John on Farscape, John and Delenn on B5, Max and Logan on Dark Angel (we will not speak of DA s2)--I loved them. Part of me loves Jack and Ianto and wants more! Part of me keeps going, "Jack's the boss. This is just a bad idea!" On the one hand, Jack is the perfect person for Ianto to love, because he can't die. On the other hand, the fact that Ianto needs to love someone who can't die is a measure of how messed up the poor boy is. On the gripping hand (virtual cookie if you identify my source for this phrase!), Ianto seems much happier now! Mopey Ianto of s1 is suddenly confident, kicking the bad guys, wriggling out of ropes, and making hilarious comments! ("We could cut a single." "I know everything. Plus, it's at the bottom of the screen.")
But being romantically involved with the boss is a bad idea. Being romantically involved with Jack is a bad idea.
So--yes, there is a discussion question here--is anyone else a little freaked about Jack and Ianto? Jack is really the boss, and, aside from that nasty little incident where they ganged up on him and Owen killed him, his word is law. They may argue, but then they do what he says (except for Gwen, with the retcon, but she told Jack what she was doing and why, and he did accept it, though not happily).
So, if anyone has borne with me this long--what do YOU think?
AAAAHHHHHH! Don't do this to me, Torchwood! I want escape! Not death! Owen is my least favorite character. I don't care. Give him back.
Okay, okay. I couldn't stand it. So I took the easiest cheat there is. I'm not even going to link, so you have to want to do this yourself if you want to know (unless you already get spoilers, or you're ahead of the US on episodes), but I couldn't stand it. I went straight to IMDb to see if that was Burn Gorman's last episode. I'm not giving the answer here. You can look it up if you want. You can also laugh at me for being pathetic. (I will note that Brilliant Husband, however, didn't budge from my shoulder after the YouTube clip ended while I looked up Burn Gorman.)
I haven't posted after every episode, so you get a hodgepodge of my thoughts on the last few. Mostly: I'm still loving it.
"To The Last Man": Oh, Tosh! Oh, Tommy! (Oh, SGA! Who stole whose title?)
"Meat": everyone said it was gross. It wasn't so much gross; it was terribly sad. I didn't quite cry, but I was close. Oh, Jack! You wanted to save it! You did all you could! Oh, Owen! You probably did the best that could be done at the time. I love that Gwen brought Rhys to the Hub. Her refusal to give him retcon helps make up for her terrible awful nearly unforgivable affair with Owen. I liked the little bit where Ianto says they never had a fiancé before, and Tosh says they're all pathetical singles, and Ianto and Jack just give each other a little look.
"Adam": wow. Riveting from first to last (until frelling BBCA cut out a few seconds early!). We couldn't help but notice they put Adam into the opening montage! Yay for detail work! I'd watched the previews (yeah, they give away too much, but I'm a preview addict currently trying to find a recovery program. Wait, I've got one--it's called Brilliant Husband saying, "You told me not to let you watch" and turning the tv off right before the preview for SGA's "Last Man"), so I knew he was up to no good. I think I'd have known he was up to no good anyway, though! Did this remind anyone else of SG-1's "Fifth Man"? Except that there the alien wasn't hurting anyone (not much, anyway). Adam was malicious, and very scary.
I found sweet, neat Owen really awful. (But major points to Burn Gorman for doing a totally different character! Great job!) I felt really bad for him. Adam hadn't just made him "happier," as he claimed. He made him pathetic, a target for derision. I'm not sure how much was for his own amusement, and how much was for distraction: while Owen was pining for Tosh, he wasn't noticing anything odd, and Tosh had her attention split between Adam and poor fawning Owen.
But Gwen--that was even scarier. I didn't know whether she would remember Rhys, and that was horrifying. We had a moment of happiness when she found she could essentially fall in love with him again.
But of course that couldn't last. Of course Ianto keeps a diary. Of course he keeps it at the Hub, because to take it elsewhere would violate security protocols (hey, he had a few lapses about Lisa, but otherwise, security protocols are serious, right?) And of course he notes down interesting artifacts--especially if Jack finds them. I knew when Adam found him with the diary, it would be bad, but I didn't know it would be that bad!
(Interlude: I was interested to note when I went to YouTube looking at bits to see if any contained the final scene with Jack and the box--yes, I know how that sounds--anyway, I was fast-forwarding and discovered the YouTube "Best of Jack and Ianto" clip for this episode contained a number of seconds that we hadn't seen. I couldn't see any rationale, except cutting down the time for commercial. They didn't cut the worst bits, or anything: from what I saw, and my faulty memory of the episode, they cut the moment where Adam says he helped Ianto hide the bodies, and then there's a moment showing the two of them carrying a body between them. Also, I think the BBCA version had Ianto only talk of one murder; in the clip, Jack asks him to describe the second and Ianto starts before Jack shuts off the lie detector.)
I love the way Jack dealt with Ianto here: initially scared, a little angry ("Quit joking around!") but then absolutely immovable: Ianto didn't do these things. Nothing Ianto says will convince him, and the best lie detector ever made won't convince him, so he keeps looking until he finds the answer. He doesn't consider that whatever is wrong with Ianto could really have made him murder women, because that's just not Ianto.
I also love Jack's inflexibility on what Adam has done to Tosh. Tosh still thinks it's love, and I want to send all the Stargate writers and producers who had anything to do with "Hathor" and "Irresistible" to watch the scene where Jack tells Tosh that she did not consent, no matter what she thinks right now. He's right, and continuing a drugged delusion (for that's essentially what it is, whatever the alien's mechanism) isn't free will. He persuades her--doesn't force her--to take the retcon. He doesn't say "rape," but he doesn't have to.
Jack's losing points for having read Ianto's diary at the end. I know he doesn't really remember what happened, so he has no particular concern with violating his team's memories right now--but you just don't do that. Yes, even if you think it's about you, Jack, you don't do it. (Husband says that, having done it, he's right to tip off Ianto that he has; I concur, but still!)
And "Reset"!
Martha totally rules! I was so thrilled to see her! Loved her with all the team! Trading quips with Jack--the only one who can fully keep up! She had Owen totally outgunned. Martha and Gwen: "Are we the only two people on the planet...?" "What're we doing wrong?" Laughing at Jack!
Could not believe that Jack not only asked for a UNIT cap, he told Martha who he wanted it for! But he and Ianto seem to be discreet, although I never thought I'd use "Jack Harkness" and "discreet" in the same sentence! And then Martha had the nerve to ask Ianto about Jack! Ianto got the deer in the headlights look for a moment, and then recovers! "Innovative. Bordering on avant-garde." We howled (and had to run the TiVo back to catch the lines we'd missed). I guess the boys are both happy, and they want to be able to tell someone. I'm glad they're happy. I want it to last.
Hepatitis! Brilliant! You know what's more brilliant? Taping the assassin to the steering wheel of the SUV! Tosh, I love you! Ianto: "You are warped deep inside. How do you even think of these things?"
But Owen! Nooo! Now Martha will feel guilty, because they were rescuing her, whereas if she'd just left the compound as she was supposed to, no one would have been shot! Don't know if we'll see Martha again. Didn't look her up. Can't hear you (la la la).
Questions for discussion!
1. Rhys saw Adam briefly; does that keep him alive in some small way?
1a. Do Rhys and Gwen ever compare notes about those 48 hours?
2. Owen denies sending the flowers at the end of "Adam," but he gives Tosh that funny little smile that we only saw on Geek!Owen previously. Then, in "Reset," he finally agrees to go out with Tosh! Does this mean there are bits of not-quite conscious memory left? Is Adam still affecting them? (Does this mean Tosh feels love for someone she can't remember? Worse, that Ianto feels guilty for horrible crimes he can't quite remember? I was afraid that Gwen might have residual doubts about Rhys, but I hope that's wrong! Do not want!)
3. Has Owen's death saved Tosh from a train wreck? Because if they'd gone on that date (did he really not realize she was asking him on a date? How dense!), more would have followed, and--well, Jack used a line I frequently use while watching shows including Torchwood: "It will end in tears."
4. I said if Tosh and Owen would be a train wreck, Jack and Ianto could be a multi-train pile-up. "No," said BH. "Just street pizza." (Had to ask for a translation. I'm more familiar with "road kill" or "flattened fauna.") Of course, we concluded that after the whole CyberLisa debacle, street pizza might be bit of a relief.
I feel ridiculously torn. I'm not much of a shipper on most shows. Keep your romance off my Stargate shows (those writers can't do it anyway), and Star Trek, for the most part. But Aeryn and John on Farscape, John and Delenn on B5, Max and Logan on Dark Angel (we will not speak of DA s2)--I loved them. Part of me loves Jack and Ianto and wants more! Part of me keeps going, "Jack's the boss. This is just a bad idea!" On the one hand, Jack is the perfect person for Ianto to love, because he can't die. On the other hand, the fact that Ianto needs to love someone who can't die is a measure of how messed up the poor boy is. On the gripping hand (virtual cookie if you identify my source for this phrase!), Ianto seems much happier now! Mopey Ianto of s1 is suddenly confident, kicking the bad guys, wriggling out of ropes, and making hilarious comments! ("We could cut a single." "I know everything. Plus, it's at the bottom of the screen.")
But being romantically involved with the boss is a bad idea. Being romantically involved with Jack is a bad idea.
So--yes, there is a discussion question here--is anyone else a little freaked about Jack and Ianto? Jack is really the boss, and, aside from that nasty little incident where they ganged up on him and Owen killed him, his word is law. They may argue, but then they do what he says (except for Gwen, with the retcon, but she told Jack what she was doing and why, and he did accept it, though not happily).
So, if anyone has borne with me this long--what do YOU think?
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Ianto was the first to hint at having a relationship, so it's not so bad, but still...I often wonder if he started a relationship with Jack to distance himself from pain, or to get in Jack's good graces after Lisa (yes, I went there - sucking up to the boss in the worst way to keep your job). But either way, though it is made of awesome - still, bad things afoot there. They love each other, but not enough, I think. They keep - I hate to say using, but it fits - each other to keep pain and loneliness at bay, and no relationship can surviv on that alone - especially when one of them has an eye on the unobtainable (Gwen)...
Lookit me ramble!!
*Smishes*
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I'm not sure when the relationship started, which is a really tricky bit: In the second-last episode, when Owen and Ianto are arguing, Ianto says, "He's our leader!" and "Jack needs me!" and Owen replies "in your dreams" (only cruder than that). So at that point, I figured anything going on was in Ianto's head. At the end of the next episode, when Jack finally comes back to life, Ianto goes to shake his hand, and Jack pulls him into a hug and then a kiss--so I figured Jack knew that Ianto was attracted to him, maybe even loved him, but that nothing was going on yet. In the first episode of the second season, Jack asks Ianto out for dinner and a movie, and Ianto's clearly surprised: "You're asking me out on a date?" Jack has to ask again before Ianto says yes.
So I figured that the two of them only get together after Jack's return from his little excursion with the Doctor and Martha.
Do you think Jack really wants Gwen that badly? I figure he wants darned near everyone, and he's certainly attracted to her (and she to him, at least a bit), but he's quite aware of Rhys, and I think Jack's really trying not to screw up Gwen's life any more than it already is.
I think there's real love on both sides, but, as you say, is it enough? Even if they have the best of intentions, Jack lusts after most things that move, and he's got history--over a century and a half, at least! They also both know he's going to outlive Ianto, that even if they spend years together, it will end up being just a tiny part of Jack's apparently virtually infinite lifespan. Can Ianto be satisfied with that? And how much can Jack let himself get attached to someone he knows will die long before him? It's hard enough when you think someone you love might die before you (we all have that), but Jack knows with near-certainty.
That's before you figure in the other psychological messes each man has, and the boss-employee relationship.... They're headed for trouble, but dang, it'll be quite something while it lasts.
Never worry about rambling on my LJ! Look at the length of my posts and comments!
From:
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But yes, that is the dilemma - and something that Gwen sparked in him that made him so tragic in many ways. Jack had given up, he didn't WANT to feel anymore, though from his actions in Cyberwoman, he'd always felt something for poor, lonely, forgotten Ianto. But GWEN. Gwen made him reach out again and be HUMAN. And since he ordered her to keep her life together, or no job - he can't necessarily protest her life with Rhys. He can't interfere, though he was hoping )in some small way) that it wouldn't last.
He loves Ianto - but he is unsure of Ianto's feelings - so once again, that DISTANCE that's there. Does Ianto want HIM, or is Ianto keeping the boss amused to prtoect his job? Jack is famous for his flings - but he has them now to CONNECT, to feel a part of it all. He 'dabbled' and played before, just for the sheer love of life, and the need to connect even then - but now it is so much more intense and frightening - because yes, HE will go on - but no one else does. It is frightening and painful, and something that he dreads each time he gets close. Something that Jack naturally craves anyway - that closeness. think how bad it is to spend centuries trying to fight your own nature, damn sure you just can't take that pain over and over again.
Damn I ramble... Maybe I should fic...*whimpers*
From:
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Maybe Jack was afraid Ianto was just trying to keep in good with the boss. That was hardly necessary, though! If Jack didn't fire (and retcon!) Ianto after "Cyberwoman," I don't think Ianto had much to worry about. (I wanted Jack to fire Ianto after "Cyberwoman," and quite badly, too!) I think Ianto was lonely, and saw Jack as lonely--which, of course, he is--and Jack as the one who kept him going after Lisa's death, who didn't fire him, who let him keep what mattered to him. It's not that Jack's harassing him in any way (his team are the only people Jack isn't hitting on all the time! He was darned close to hitting on Rhys!). The trouble is that Jack is in a position of authority, which Ianto very much respects, and Ianto seems to idolize him at times ("Jack's our leader!"). That's why faculty have a responsibility not to take advantage of their students, even if the students think they want it!
At the same time Ianto's a wreck in season one; he clearly seems so far in season two to be more together, happier. Jack does too. But I keep thinking, "It will end in tears."
But I'm going to watch until it does, and probably beyond. Maybe you should write something.
From:
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AAAAHHHHHH! Don't do this to me, Torchwood! I want escape! Not death! Owen is my least favorite character. I don't care. Give him back. LOL! Exactly.
Huh, Adam didn't remind me of Fifth Man, mainly because Adam was so damn creepy. I did like the actor's completely different portrayal of Owen, but I still didn't like Owen. LOL. And yes to everything you said about lanto. And apparently the ondemand "Director's cut" version does include those "missing scenes" you dind't get.
Strangely, I didn't get the same issue with the diary you did. I mean. If Jack found this diary in his office and went what's this book (I mean Torchwood, you suddenly see stuff on your desk...) so he could've seen a bit and teased Ianto about that bit without reading everything um...maybe.
Reset:
Yay to Martha! Yay to Weekend at Bernie's driver!
2. Maybe Owen just did a huh, never thought of that. Maybe it could be cool. (Tosh is a cutie)
I loved Ianto in "Adam" and wish I was seeing more characterization of him rather than Jack's love interest. I mean...not to pigeonhole Torchwood, but I still don't quite know what he does or knows or likes. LOL. (
From:
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Yes, Adam is way creepier than the nice alien in "Fifth Man" who was just trying to stay alive, but I went, "Ah, he has to touch them!" Then, of course, at the end he seems not to be touching Jack, but he says he already put himself in those memories. If I start keeping tabs of the mistakes like I do with Stargate, I'll have to quit my day job.
I can see Jack picking up the diary to see what it is, twice, because the retcon wipes the first time. The trouble is, I'm pretty sure that's not what Jack did, and I think Ianto assumes he read the whole thing (cringe).
I do like Tosh; I want to see more of her doing her stuff.
And Ianto! As far as I know,
Husband and I have been coming up with a list of his duties:
1. chief Weevil handler
2. chief stopwatch handler
3. the research guy: Tosh handles science computer stuff and is often the one to pull up the CCTV feed that seems to cover all of Cardiff and much of Wales (frighteningly!), but when it's not her, it's Ianto, and he's the one who looks up companies and people and creates cover stories and papers when one of them goes undercover.
4. manning the cover office, which is, I believe, a Welsh tourist office. That's where Martha shows up at the start of "Reset," to find him leafing through a magazine and paying no real attention to her.
5. ordering the pizza and getting tea for everyone. (Owen calls him "the tea boy" in "Captain Jack Harkness." Not a good thing to say to the guy holding the gun on you, Owen.)
The first time he went into the field, BH and I were laughing: "They brought the office manager to track alien killers?" (Of course, if I wanted to bring down alien killers, and I looked around my office, I'd take our office manager too!--but that's because most of us are English professors.)
We should perhaps not look too carefully at how the operation is run. We have been complaining since we started that five people is an awfully small group to be protecting the world from the horrors that come through the Rift, and don't they have to sleep sometimes? (Well, apparently Jack doesn't usually.) I was also disturbed in "Meat" that they apparently took Rhys back and Owen removed the bullet and took care of his wound on the autopsy table without any trained help! Why on Earth didn't they take him to a hospital? Why didn't Gwen object! "Hey, that's my fiancé! Don't work on him on the table for the bodies!"
Never saw Weekend at Bernie's; should I?
I'm very glad to see Martha because I can love her without reservation, unlike Gwen (whom I quite like much of the time, though I gather from that a lot of people don't, and that
From:
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Gosh, it's been years since I've seen it so I don't remember the details but it's a comedy movie where these two college age or just out of college age guys end up having to spend a weekend at this guy Bernie's house. Bernie is some super rich dude. And Bernie...keels over dead when they've gotten there. I don't remember why they didn't just "report" him being dead. But the hilarity ensues about dragging Bernie everywhere and people thinking he's alive (the poor actor who played Bernie, LOL, even though I'm sure there was dummies sometime)
I think but am not sure that Andrew McCarthy was one of the college kids. It is actually funnier than the freaky black premise indicates, but it's not "great cinematic" magic by any stretch of the imagination. It's one of those, if you're channel flipping and notice it's playing, you may want to look for a few minutes. Heh.
From:
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Maybe that's just the Cardiff branch of Torchwood. Like the satellite office. LOL
From:
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We're enjoying watching it, but it won't stand up to the kind of analysis that I tend to go in for. DW won't either, though it's one of my first big fannish loves, so I don't get on those comms, though it is My Favorite Show of All Time.
But the Rift is in Cardiff! That had better be their first stringers! (Torchwood did, however, start in Scotland, in a DW episode called "Tooth and Claw," if I remember correctly.)
Eek! Just before posting I thought I'd take a look at that comm you mentioned--and the most recent post seems to have a big spoiler photo. Augh! Hand me some retcon, please! Darned UK is 2 1/2 weeks ahead of us! Don't look! Not your fault--there are only four rules on the comm, and one of them is "put spoilers under cuts." One of the images is someone's userpic, and the other is an ad for a ficathon or something. I left a note for the mod that US viewers are behind UK viewers, and that spoiler images are, well, spoilers. Just don't look if you don't want to know.